0:00Hello, I thought I'd do a video on the
0:13issues of race and ethnic minorities that's
0:21kind
0:21of been on convo this week but also on
0:24Friday. I really didn't have an opportunity
0:27to talk
0:27much about the issue largely because I was
0:30consulting the whole week and so I didn't
0:33get much of an opportunity to really be
0:35engaged in the discussion as it was
0:37happening but
0:38also you know a lot of people reached out
0:41to me to kind of try and scope my opinions
0:43and I didn't have time to respond to those
0:46things and so I thought I could share my
0:49views
0:49but I thought I could maybe hopefully do a
0:52bit more than that and sort of share my
0:54experiences
0:55as a black individual not just in the
0:57company I work for but also in the tableau
0:59community
1:00more broadly. Now I normally script all my
1:05videos, I do, so I've actually literally
1:08written everything I was going to say here,
1:10I literally typed the whole thing but I'm
1:11not going to actually read it, I just
1:13thought you know it's good to get your
1:15thoughts
1:15out on paper and on screen in this sense
1:19and just talk out loud essentially and I
1:22want
1:23to sort of give some context to what I'm
1:25going to talk about today. These are my
1:27opinions
1:28and some of them aren't necessarily you
1:31know correct so if you think I'm saying
1:33something
1:34that you don't necessarily agree with
1:35please engage in the discussion, let's talk
1:37about
1:38it. Secondly, I'm sort of saying what I'm
1:42saying from how I see the world and how I
1:45see things happening again in my company or
1:47outside of the company in the tableau
1:49community
1:50or the wider world and so my experience is
1:52unique to me and other people will have
1:55different
1:56experiences that they are probably one to
1:58share as well so highly encourage other
2:00people
2:00to sort of you know come up to the plate
2:03and talk about their experiences you know
2:07as they
2:07experience them or as it comes to them. Now
2:10I wanted to sort of approach this
2:14discussion
2:15from three key areas. Opportunity is the
2:18first one, context is the second one and
2:21the last
2:21one is about sort of education but it's a
2:24little bit more than that, it's about
2:27education
2:27with a view of moving closer towards sort
2:30of intellectual empathy and that's actually
2:33like sounds like I'm so far up my own ass
2:36but just bear with me and I'll explain sort
2:39of where I'm coming from. Okay so I'll
2:42start first with opportunity. Now I was
2:46born in
2:47Kenya in Nairobi so I'm actually an African
2:50and I never identify as an African. I came
2:53to this country when I was about five years
2:56old and my parents migrated here a couple
2:59of years before that and I came over a
3:02couple of years later. Now the challenge I
3:05always
3:06had is you know my parents follow the
3:08traditional sort of migrant story you know.
3:12They were
3:13born in Nairobi in Kenya, there's not many
3:16opportunities especially given sort of the
3:18context of what was happening in the
3:20country at the time and they thought well
3:22maybe there's
3:23an opportunity to move to another country
3:25where the opportunities are better for them
3:28in their professions in healthcare but also
3:32for me as a young child and so they
3:35experienced
3:36a challenge actually. I think many migrant
3:38stories experience lots of different
3:40challenges
3:40but the challenge my parents experience is
3:42that in order to come here they actually
3:44had
3:45to leave me in Kenya and so for many of my
3:48formative years you know from about three
3:51till about five my parents weren't actually
3:54there and not because they didn't want to
3:56be there or they couldn't be there. It was
3:59because they were trying to create a better
4:01opportunity for myself and themselves from
4:04a family more broadly okay. And there's
4:08actually
4:08a funny story behind that because when I
4:10actually did get the opportunity to come to
4:12the UK
4:13for the first time they had to stay here
4:15for a bit of time without me and then after
4:17a
4:17couple of years I was actually able to go
4:19over. When I actually arrived in the UK I
4:22had some British Airways flight I had an
4:24air hostess looking after me the whole way.
4:26I
4:27think I had probably the best experience I
4:28've ever had on a plane and it was actually
4:30my
4:30first ever flight as well you know in any
4:33plane and I got to the UK and my parents
4:36were
4:37waiting for me at the border and I was
4:39asked to identify them and I couldn't. The
4:43harsh
4:44reality is when you last saw your parents
4:47at three slash four and then you see them
4:49again at five and six your recollection of
4:52who they are just hadn't formed. So there
4:55was actually a bit of a hoo-ha around this
4:58and I spent several hours at the airport
5:00whilst
5:00they got their papers in order to kind of
5:03prove that I was their son and eventually
5:05we all went home. But my point here is that
5:08you know lots of migrant stories come from
5:10this issue of challenge and actually that
5:13challenge continues once they get here and
5:17it can vary some sometimes it's social
5:19challenges maybe it's cultural challenges
5:22but one of
5:23the other challenges they often talk about
5:25especially migrant parents is they'll often
5:27talk to you when you're young about the
5:30issue of race. And this issue for me
5:33personally
5:33is actually very different to I think what
5:36most people will expect. I think when you
5:38hear about racism the first thing you think
5:41of is race or race based on ethnicity or
5:44skin
5:44color. And actually in my experience it was
5:47very different and to give some back story
5:49very very briefly I came to the UK I was a
5:51couple of years behind my educational
5:54levels
5:54that I needed to be to enter the UK system
5:57and so the parents found a school but in
5:59essence
6:00they didn't feel it was good enough because
6:02I was already behind and I needed a lot of
6:04special sort of attention in that sense to
6:07catch up academically. So they took a punt
6:09and they sent me actually to private school
6:12and you know I was in a class of six or
6:14seven
6:14pretty much all the way throughout my
6:17education and long story short I was the
6:19only black
6:20kid in school like it was always the norm
6:23for me and I struggled to fit in not
6:25because
6:26not because you know the color of my skin
6:29but actually because in those environments
6:31during that time it was actually rather
6:35unusual for someone of a my skin color and
6:38be a lot
6:38of my cultural background and see of my
6:41parents sort of professional background to
6:43be putting
6:44their kid through private education. And so
6:48it was a rather sort of interesting time
6:51because
6:51I was also trying to fit in I just sort of
6:54left another country and trying to
6:56understand
6:57the British sort of cultural ways at the
7:00same time trying to sort of form a sense of
7:03identity
7:04and not really finding anywhere I could fit
7:07in and you know this became sort of a
7:10bigger
7:10and bigger challenge throughout my life
7:13basically throughout education. I pretty
7:16much carried
7:17on through private education until I
7:19finished college and actually that's where
7:21the issue
7:22really sort of run home to me because I
7:25just still couldn't fit in. You know I went
7:27from
7:27a school of you know 50 people in primary
7:30school 50 to 70 people then I left that and
7:33I became the only black kid in a school of
7:35about 800 people. So I went from one in 50
7:39to one in 800 and in my sort of story this
7:43sounds like a very privileged story I have
7:47to sort of emphasize that and I am very
7:49privileged and I'm very fortunate to have
7:51had that opportunity.
7:52My parents worked extremely hard they did
7:55you know night shifts and double shifts
7:58just
7:58to meet the you know fees to get into these
8:01private schools and you know a funny twist
8:04of this is you know you would probably say
8:06why didn't I go for a scholarship I didn't
8:08know such a thing existed. It just wasn't
8:11in our sort of discourse or sort of
8:13understanding
8:14of how these things worked and so you know
8:17my parents just worked extremely hard to
8:20sort
8:21of put me through that experience and I
8:23continued to struggle to fit in because I
8:26was going
8:27to school with people who were you know
8:29reasonably well off and very relaxed. Their
8:33parents weren't
8:33working as hard as my parents were working
8:36to put me through education and I also had
8:38this pressure because I knew my parents
8:40were working hard to put me through this
8:43process
8:43and so at the same time I didn't really fit
8:46in with the kids the kids at school and
8:49likewise
8:50whenever I networked with people from my
8:52ethnic origin or people from my sort of
8:55background
8:56I also struggled to fit in there because to
8:58them I was too posh and yet at the same
9:00time
9:01I wasn't getting A's in English at school
9:03and so I was caught in the middle of this
9:06really bizarre dilemma where I was really
9:08struggling for identity I was really
9:10struggling
9:11to understand like where do I fit in how do
9:13I do this how do I pull this off and
9:15eventually
9:15I went to university and I became one
9:17person in 12,000 students but luckily I
9:21wasn't the
9:21only black kid in school in fact at
9:24university I experienced so many other
9:27cultural backgrounds
9:29and diverse backgrounds that that's when I
9:31really started to realize that I flourished
9:32I started to realize that you know actually
9:35you know I didn't have to struggle to fit
9:38in I could just be myself and that's when
9:41things started to click I started you know
9:43taking part in lots of different sort of
9:46activities and meeting new people a funny
9:49thing in school
9:50whenever I told people I played rugby they
9:52'd always look at me like some some weirdo
9:54because
9:54they all played football that's that's just
9:56you know that's just the difference in in
9:58sort of backgrounds that we had and yet in
10:00university I could just carry on playing
10:02rugby
10:03and in fact there were many other black
10:05kids playing rugby and you know in that in
10:08that
10:09in that sort of setting and so at
10:11university that's when I finally felt that
10:14I could you
10:14know become myself and I had this sort of
10:17space to grow and become sort of a better
10:20person and to the point where that led to
10:22me being elected as a student
10:24representative
10:25and that was a really powerful moment for
10:27me because it wasn't just about being
10:30elected
10:30it was actually being something really
10:33stood out to me here I was being elected to
10:36represent
10:37other students from all walks of life not
10:40just you know students like myself but
10:43students
10:44from all walks of life studying a whole
10:46range of subject and that was the first
10:48time for
10:49me that I really realized that you know
10:51that was an achievement that was born from
10:54my hard
10:54work and my ability to represent people
10:57rather than anything that had sort of you
11:00know restricted
11:01me from going for that opportunity because
11:04of the color of my skin and so I I just I
11:06just really grew into that role and I got
11:09re-elected to a second year and then
11:11eventually
11:12I loved York so much I ended up staying
11:14there and I never really experienced any
11:17any racism
11:18really no outward racism there was always a
11:21subtle racism I have to say that even even
11:24in school there was always sort of
11:25subconscious racism for example people
11:27would always say
11:28they were surprised that someone of my skin
11:30color or background could speak English so
11:33well I always used to sort of get this
11:35perspective I got to grade five in piano
11:38and people were
11:39surprised that you know someone of my
11:41background could could play the piano and
11:43stuff like
11:43that so there was these sort of small small
11:45things and I didn't think of anything of it
11:48at the time but over time I started to
11:50realize that actually you know these are
11:52the small
11:53instances of not necessarily racism but
11:56bias that you have to stand up for and I
11:59separate
12:00those two because I think racism is
12:03something that's extremely overt as well as
12:06subtle but
12:08it's unfair to just blanket everything with
12:11the term racism because in other cases
12:13racist
12:14bias is just different from straight out in
12:16your face racism which I have experienced
12:18but I fundamentally believe they're two two
12:22different things now if I push forward I
12:25left
12:26York after about seven years there and I I
12:29basically realized when I went freelance
12:33that
12:33university had created this bubble a safety
12:35bubble almost that you know where I could
12:37be myself and then as soon as I went
12:39freelance and I was trying to put myself in
12:41front of
12:42new clients and potential clients I really
12:45struggled I realized almost very quickly
12:47that
12:47the thing I was actually fighting against
12:50wasn't so much my skill or lack of skill or
12:52lack of experience it was actually the fact
12:55that in any process where I was putting
12:58myself
12:59forward and people could see my ethnicity I
13:01wasn't getting the opportunities that I
13:03wanted so I changed my tack actually I
13:06changed my approach and I started putting
13:09myself through
13:10processes where you didn't need to sort of
13:13see my ethnicity in order to judge my
13:16skills
13:16and so I actually made a really good income
13:19off a platform called oDesk oDesk way back
13:22when in 2000 and I think it was 2000 and oh
13:25man I don't even know how long ago this was
13:28so I think seven or eight years ago oDesk
13:30was a platform a bit like Upwork today
13:32where
13:32you could essentially sell your skills and
13:35so I did like graphic design magazine
13:37design
13:38freelance there I entered competitions I
13:41actually got to the final of a BBC Radio 4
13:45digital
13:45experience competition around podcasting
13:48when it was a new and sort of amazing thing
13:51and
13:51got to the finals of that we didn't win
13:53unfortunately an agency won but as a freel
13:56ancer out there
13:57doing that thing on my own I found it
13:59incredibly incredibly rewarding to go
14:01through those processes
14:02and so I realized hey the way to succeed
14:05isn't to sort of put your ethnicity out
14:07there and
14:09you know sort of have to take on these
14:11challenges head on it's actually put your
14:13work forward
14:14first and so I started doing exactly that I
14:16talked to my friends I'd asked them if they
14:19had people that needed work and I'd get
14:20referrals through my friends that way and
14:23actually that
14:23that started to be quite a successful thing
14:25and I figured this out within the space of
14:26three months and I did that for about eight
14:30months now another thing I started doing
14:33was
14:33also just putting out my work on Twitter
14:35and reaching out to people directly rather
14:36than
14:37waiting for people to come to me I started
14:39reaching out to people and one of those
14:41people
14:41I reached out to was actually Craig Craig
14:43Bloodworth for the information lab and it
14:45was incredible because that's how I ended
14:47up doing the job I do today a job that I
14:50you
14:50know passionately love and the way that
14:52works out was I actually tweeted something
14:55about
14:55quantified self as many of you know I'm
14:58really into that and I talked about the
15:00ways of getting
15:01this data together in sort of a meaningful
15:03way and it was an idea that I had in my
15:04head
15:04for a startup and I actually asked Craig to
15:07be my mentor and Craig agreed and he's very
15:10supportive but then a couple of weeks later
15:12he just messaged me and sort of said well
15:14would you like to sort of explore this idea
15:17of working with Tableau and specifically
15:19data
15:19in Tableau and that was that was an
15:21interesting thing because I'd seen Tableau
15:23but I didn't
15:24actually know what it was at the time and
15:27so I sort of went along with it and I saw
15:29freelancing so I was still sort of
15:30passionate about being independent but I
15:32also wanted
15:33to see what this thing was and so I met
15:36Craig very briefly had a conversation and
15:39then I
15:40met Tom you know in in London we just I
15:43just went to one Alfred place which is like
15:47a co-working
15:47space we had a one-on-one conversation I
15:50brought some books about design and I was
15:52trying to
15:52persuade Tom that you know my design skills
15:54were second to none because that's that's
15:57what I had going for me my design skills
15:59were you know the strongest asset I had and
16:03Tom
16:03very politely told me that you know in
16:06analytics design is sort of second to
16:10function and he's
16:11still really encouraged by my approach and
16:14sort of suggested well okay let's speak to
16:16another colleague so I spoke to Robin I
16:18actually met Robin in Starbucks and that
16:21was an interesting
16:22experience because I borrowed a netbook
16:24from my my brother because I didn't
16:25actually have
16:26a laptop I had a desktop machine for design
16:28work but I didn't have a laptop so sat
16:30there
16:31in Starbucks on this tiny little netbook it
16:33was it was so small Tableau could barely
16:34run
16:35on it and I was showing my visualization
16:38which was absolutely awful and yeah the you
16:41know
16:41the three of them took a chance on me
16:43essentially I didn't have a CV that said
16:45anything that
16:46I could work in analytics it was very much
16:49an opportunity they gave to me and it was
16:51it was done on this basis which was quite
16:54simply listen and we can see you have the
16:56passion for data and why don't you spend a
16:58month working alongside us and let's see
17:01where
17:01you go and then three months later I was
17:03working for a client my very first client
17:06who I then
17:06worked for for a year and carried on and I
17:10have to say that process itself was was an
17:14opportunity as well because at no point did
17:16Tom look at my CV or did anyone look at my
17:19CV and say Tim doesn't have these skills
17:21what they did is they looked at my passion
17:24and
17:24so to sort of round off the point I'm
17:26making here throughout my life any time
17:29where an
17:30opportunity has been available that looks
17:33at my skill set and what I'm capable of
17:36first
17:37I've always taken it and I've always exce
17:39lled and I think that should be the context
17:42of
17:42that should be the context of I think how
17:44we start to look at solving this challenge
17:47I'd hate to I'd hate to be put in a
17:49situation where because of the color of my
17:53skin people
17:54sort of create an opportunity for me and I
17:57wouldn't want to work in a place where
18:00because
18:01of the color of my skin I had more
18:02opportunities than others because then that
18:04's just the flip
18:05side of the current situation in society
18:08right it's the same thing the other way
18:10around that's
18:11not what we want and it's not just about
18:14you know people who are black it's also
18:17about
18:18other ethnic minorities as well and so we
18:21have to strive to create opportunities
18:23where
18:24people can quite simply show what they can
18:28do and excel in that way and have chances
18:31and opportunities to do that and the
18:33narrative that you're seeing now is that
18:36you know a
18:36lot of ethnic minorities just don't get
18:38that opportunity full stop because of the
18:41presumptions
18:42or assumptions that are made wrongly about
18:44you know the ethnicity or the color of
18:46their
18:46skin and so that's sort of the first key
18:48point opportunity is such an important
18:51thing but
18:51at the same time that's all I think people
18:54really want the opportunity to be seen on
18:57the same standard as everyone else and be
19:00judged purely on merit and not not anything
19:03else okay. The next thing I wanted to touch
19:10on is context and context is hard because
19:15it's an issue of relativity you know two
19:19people stood at the same point in life will
19:23look
19:23out into the world and see different things
19:26it's just the way the world works okay and
19:29when we look at this issue of race
19:31especially in an organizational context or
19:33in the sense
19:34of the community you have to understand
19:38that it's not as simple as just sort of
19:41joining
19:41the bandwagon and just amplifying the
19:44message you have to do so in a way that's
19:46respectful
19:47of the context and I say that as someone
19:50who in real terms compared to other people
19:54in
19:54this country or in the world who've
19:57suffered from racism haven't hasn't really
19:59suffered
20:00extreme racism in that sense I've never
20:03been subject to that and so you know
20:05everything
20:05I'm talking to you about can only come from
20:08a very sort of narrow perspective and that
20:10is my perspective and the issue of context
20:14is that we you can't take racism as we see
20:17it let's say in the UK and compare it to
20:19racism as we see it in America because each
20:22society
20:23is at different levels of understanding of
20:25that issue and maturity of that issue the
20:27other thing is that you also have to take
20:29into the context the context of the world
20:31we live in today I mean notwithstanding all
20:34the issues of race around the world we are
20:37living in a pandemic here and every single
20:41day people are suffering not because of
20:45race
20:46but purely because of an unknown disease it
20:49's you know killing people indiscriminately
20:52irrespective
20:53of their race and so we are living in very
20:55sort of different times where we can't get
20:58in a room and talk to each other face to
21:00face we can't get in a room and sort of
21:02passionate
21:03discuss this and so when we talk about
21:05solving this problem we have to do it in
21:07the context
21:07of the world we live in today and in a
21:11business it's even harder because the
21:15parameters of
21:16what you can actually change is very sort
21:18of very actually narrow if you think about
21:20it not least because well if you're in
21:23consulting like myself the majority of your
21:27spine the
21:28majority of the time you spend isn't
21:29actually spent in the context of your own
21:31company you
21:32spend it with clients and when you have
21:34three or four five six seven eight clients
21:36a year
21:37those are six or seven different sort of
21:39circumstances and environments and context
21:42is that you have
21:43to sort of adjust for very very quickly and
21:45let's say you experience racism in those
21:48settings
21:49well it's even harder because you're on
21:51your own like if you don't have the
21:53professional
21:54experience and let's say someone like
21:56myself has you know seven eight years in
21:59profession
22:00you might not have the courage or
22:02confidence or even assertiveness to be able
22:04to approach
22:05the issue directly if it happens to you or
22:08if it happens to someone else and so
22:10context
22:11is extremely important in this setting
22:13because you have to you have to take that
22:15into account
22:16and also let's not also forget that in the
22:18context of businesses you know many
22:20businesses
22:21are struggling just to keep the lights on
22:23it's not it's not a it's not a simple issue
22:25where you know businesses can just can just
22:29very quickly take on this issue and so we
22:32as individuals everyone in any organization
22:35has to really step up and help our bosses
22:38help our management understand this issue
22:41because in any other situation if this was
22:43the only issue then they'd have a lot more
22:46mind share and time to sort of deal with
22:48this
22:48and so we have to be patient about this
22:51issue both as a community and as
22:53individuals in
22:54our own organizations and also in our
22:57society more broadly we can be activists
23:00today but
23:01we have to understand that the outcomes
23:03will come much much further down the line
23:05and in
23:06between now and then we have a role to play
23:08to make sure that we all get there and I
23:10think
23:11that's an important thing to sort of bear
23:13in mind the context of how we solve this
23:14issue
23:15today in a digital world changes the way we
23:17approach this it changes how difficult some
23:20discussions are and it changes how easy
23:23some steps are so we have to take advantage
23:26or
23:26you know bear in mind the difficulties that
23:28either side of that that coin sort of
23:30proposes
23:31and so I think I think that's something
23:34that we can all do to kind of think you
23:36know in
23:37the world we live in today what can I do to
23:39bring about change okay and that brings me
23:42to my final point which is the one the one
23:44way I sounded really up myself which is
23:46sort
23:47of education to help improve sort of
23:49collective empathy right and this is a
23:53tough one and
23:54I hope you may be clocked that by sharing
23:56my experience of racism right at the start
23:58and I say racism it's also bias in some
24:01cases where it's not as severe I'm trying
24:04to sort
24:04of educate people on the types of things
24:07that you know people like me might go
24:10through because
24:11it's not until you listen to several
24:13experiences like mine you can really start
24:16to understand
24:17that and the other challenge here is that
24:19it's all well and good you as an individual
24:22listening to me or listen to a podcast or
24:25reading an article about it all of that
24:27doesn't
24:28actually build towards collective empathy
24:30what builds towards collective empathy is
24:32when you then take what you've learned and
24:34you bring it back to a setting a context
24:37and
24:37we talk about it and it's really hard
24:39because talking about this is really
24:41uncomfortable
24:41in some cases right it's uncomfortable for
24:43someone who comes from that ethnic minority
24:45because you have to bring up instances that
24:47you'd rather hope to be buried in the past
24:49right and maybe you found yourself now
24:51being more assertive and able to handle
24:53them but
24:54now you have to really dig deep and sort of
24:56think back to to this sort of these pain
24:59points
24:59which your brain is naturally designed to
25:03forget and then on the flip side of that
25:06the
25:06collective sort of collective empathy only
25:09comes about when when we talk about these
25:12things we're not afraid to take on really
25:14tough subjects right some of these are tab
25:17oos
25:17we have to talk about really difficult
25:19terms we have to talk about really
25:21difficult scenarios
25:23and at the same time people are trying not
25:25to step on eggshells right I fully
25:26appreciate
25:27that I bet you in this organization or in
25:30the community in general there are people
25:33who are very careful of what they say in
25:35fact they'd rather not say anything for
25:37fear of
25:38saying the wrong thing and that's actually
25:41the worst possible scenario to be in
25:44because
25:45what that does is it brings about silence
25:47and where there is silence there is no
25:50action
25:50being taken like most racism happens behind
25:54closed doors and in those scenarios it's
25:57exactly
25:57silence that perpetuates those situations
26:00long term it's because no one says anything
26:02that those scenarios continue to happen and
26:05so as a group what we have to do is we have
26:08to be prepared to talk about uncomfortable
26:10things we have to be prepared to come
26:12together
26:12to talk about that and that's also hard
26:14given the context you know we can't come
26:16into a
26:16room and just talk to each other face to
26:19face and then lastly we have to bring that
26:21understanding
26:22back to a place where it's a collective
26:25understanding wherever setting you work in
26:27whether it's
26:28at home in your family you know with your
26:30colleagues at work or in the community each
26:33of those settings need to have a collective
26:36understanding on this particular issue so
26:38that when new people join they not only
26:41subconsciously see that understanding
26:43playing out consciously
26:45or directly but they can also easily find
26:49how to understand that perspective a simple
26:52example is when you join an organization
26:55how do you know what their view on racism
26:58is you
26:59typically go to the formal place which is
27:01the racial discrimination policy the
27:03problem
27:03is that is a policy about what happens when
27:05something goes wrong it's not a place to go
27:07and find what stance a company takes on
27:10racism in general before something has
27:13happened and
27:14so that understanding is a collective
27:16understanding that we have to build maybe
27:18it's in a group
27:19of people's head but every single time
27:21people come and go or join a community or
27:23leave a
27:24community that is slowly sort of decaying
27:27ever so slowly over time and so we have to
27:31work towards building that because it's
27:33only when we do that it's only when we do
27:35that
27:35that when racism happens behind closed
27:38doors and people actually have the
27:40confidence and
27:41assertiveness to stand up for people and
27:44the other side of that is you know me as a
27:46black
27:47person I also have to be willing to talk
27:49about things that are uncomfortable because
27:51how
27:51can I expect those who aren't who are sort
27:55of how can I expect those who have
27:58privilege
27:59to not have to worry about the things I
28:01have to worry about to stand up for me if I
28:03'm not
28:03willing to explain to them sort of the
28:05issues that I'm going through okay and so
28:08it's an
28:08uncomfortable place for everyone but we
28:11have to we have to talk about it we have to
28:13do
28:13so in a constructive way and we have to not
28:16be afraid to you know potentially say the
28:19wrong thing but know that we're in a
28:21supportive understanding community where we
28:23're all learning
28:24we always say there's never a silly
28:26question on combo right well on this matter
28:29there can't
28:30be a silly question either right we're all
28:32coming from a good place and so we have to
28:34be able to talk about it okay so that's
28:37pretty much me I don't have anything else
28:40to say
28:40I've talked for a really long time here I
28:42don't know how long I've been talking for
28:45I hope it's not too long but I think those
28:47are my thoughts so far I'd really sort of
28:50be interested to see a discussion come out
28:52of this I don't know where it will go and
28:54if you agree disagree let me know or talk
28:57more widely in the company about it but
29:01also
29:01yeah you know I'm sorry it's taken this
29:03long to get these views out because I feel
29:05like
29:06a few people did reach out to me to kind of
29:08you know say something about this and I
29:10just
29:10simply haven't had the time to say until
29:12now so yeah that's pretty much it that's me
29:15.
29:15.